Teddy KGB and Value Betting

Last night I watched Rounders for the 5th or 6th time, probably liked it more this time than ever before. One thing caught my eye however about Teddy KGB's card playing - the last hand of the movie in specific. The flop comes 6 7 10 and he plays Mike (Matt Damon) for some kind of draw, probably the gut straight. He bets the hand appropriately as the turn comes rag, then river ace. He claims "That ace could not have helped you" and after Mike checks, he moves all in.

When I'd watched the movie times before, it didn't mean anything to be, only that Matt had correctly slow-played his opponent right into a trap after flopping the best hand (6-10 straight). When I thought about it this time, I didn't understand why KBG would make the all-in bet when he was checked to. If he played his opponent correctly, he should have the best hand and can simply check and win in a showdown. Seem like a clear cut case of "value betting" done incorrectly - don't make a large bet on the river against a hit-or-miss hand, because you won't gain any more money but you might lose a bunch more.

I know it's just a movie, but the poker in the movie is done so well this just caught my eye. Let me know what you think.

Yeah, I've thought about that part before to. If KGB puts Matt on a missed draw, he should just check the river. The only explanation is that KGB is bluffing!

That seems likely, or perhaps Teddy flopped top two pair (just like the one Matt layed down earlier) and hoped Matt had something like A 8 and connected on the river. In this case he would actually be trying to induce a call. Making a statement like "That ace could not have helped you," similar to Matt's statement earlier "I'm gonna go all in, because I don't think you've got the spades" makes me think he in fact wanted Matt to call.

good thing for mucking or we wouldn't be having this insightful conversation about KGB's cards...

Teddy was definetly representing aces. When That last ace came we was almost sure he had the hand. That's why he moved all in.

I like it Jvelez... he, like Matt at the beginning of the movie, probably had the second best hand. It makes more sense than that he was bluffing. That scenario also plays into what happens earlier in the scene, where Matt spots and reveals Teddy's tell (the cookies!). "Even Teddy KGB isn't immune to getting a little rattled sometimes." He was already upset and wouldn't have even considered that Matt had 89.

This ties back into my other post, about Teddy's "tell." He puts oreo's on a chip rack next to him as an intimidation technique (I guess). Matt remembers from his first loss to Teddy KGB that when Teddy held the nuts (besides quad 9's, but come on), he broke an oreo in half and ate it. Teddy does the same oreo thing when he flops the nut straight, and Matt consequently folds his top 2 pair.

If you think back to earlier in that last scene, Matt is dealt KK and raises 1,000. Teddy raises to 5,000 and after Matt moves all-in, Teddy goes through the oreo routine again but this time folds. What is the significance of this, if any? Clearly he didn't have the best hand this time (AA) or else he would've called.

What are you guys Ebert, and Roebert? Its a damn movie, sit back and enjoy it, its like any other movie, FLAWED!

When he had the best hand he broke the oreo apart next to his ear, however whn he was bluffing he did not. That's how matt knew to call his all-in

It's not a flaw...KGB could have had 2 pair or a set and assume that Mike had the flushdraw witch was Mikes intention, in other words a perfect bear trap.

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