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Go Back   Poker Forums > Texas Hold Em Rooms > Advice & Strategy > Beginners Table

AK - the hardest premium hand to play in NL

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Old 05-12-2005, 10:49 AM
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Default AK - the hardest premium hand to play in NL

We have had hundreds of posts about how to play AA but very little has been said about AK - true it is nowhere near as glamorous a hand as AA but it is often much harder to play or at least causes more tournament exits than almost any other hand.

AA to me is pretty simple - fast play if you think you will get action and otherwise slowplay it. If you slow play it you are not wanting to commit many chips to it (preflop) because if something scary comes along you are wanting to dump it. Floping an A will secure the hand for you if there are no straights or flushes possible but the card that will give you most profit is a K. Again on a scare flop (eg 88K, 8910, 6H4H9H - particularly if ) you should not try to build the pot and should settle for other players folding to a small bet/raise on your part. If the flop looks reasonably safe then slowplaying it can be effective but depending on reads fast playing post flop may have advantages. If you get any scary cards on the turn / river then try to cap the bets so that if your opponent happens to have something big then you dont lose too much. Otherwise you use your judgement and can win pretty big on this one.

KK, QQ and JJ are normally best slowplayed and ditched if there are any scary cards. Sometimes JJ is a good blind stealing hand but generally slow play them and chuck them if you are in doubt.

AK on the other hand is a much more tricky customer. In freerolls MTT's going all in preflop has quite a bit of merit. People have strange tendancies to call with AQ, AJ, KQ, KJ, all of which you dominate. Even in money tourneys it is an excellent all in hand pre flop with only AA really dominating it. Sure you are a dog to KK but there is a decent chance that an A will appear. On the down side you are not quite 50% v any pocket pair - so this kind of play can lead to an early exit. Also you might find yourself winning big against AQ, AJ after the flop anyway. Still AK is a hand that can call all ins from people who havent been quite as solid enough to read them as holding AA or KK. Still calling/ betting big on AK is risky and if you are much better than you opponents it is not all that great an idea.

If you flop an A or a K then you have probably won the hand but there is still the issue of 1) maximising profit if you have the best of it 2) avoiding getting beat big by hidden trips etc. Depending on the level of your opponents and the reads you have on them you might play this hand post flop in several different ways. Late position this kind of hand is quite easy to play. You should have some feel of what you can take your opponents actions before you to mean and you will know where you stand. If you have under bet this hand on the flop then there is more margin from claiming the pot early to avoid people realising that you were doing this but not enough margin to justify limiting your profit on the hand too much. The general rule of thumb is that I pair + best kicker isnt good enough a hand to slow play - there is too much chance of the opponents beating you. This being said - if you have good reads on your opponent you can avoid this. Late position though you should normally be raising and hoping to get reraised with your best pair+ highest kicker.

Early position is trickier - if you bet then there are many people who would often fold their A paired + 8 that if you check would raise and then sometimes take you as bluffing and re-raise. There is a margin for checking and then folding or capping the betting if you end up giving opponents a free card that looks scary. There is slightly more margin in slowplaying a paired K as if an A happens to appear on the turn or river then you can win big against AQ, etc. But in my view you are really trying to check raise rather than slow play this hand. Betting will be worth while if you think from the way your opponents have been playing they wouldnt fold top pair with a low kicker or mid pair.

OK what about if the flop is no help to you? There is always something to be said for betting biggish on any flop that isnt likely to help anyone else. It will often get folds. I will not say too much about this because I dont want to give everything away about my game but any of you who have played quite a few hands will know that fast playing this kind of hand if someone calls or raises you can end in a nose-bleed. It is amazing how often people will call your biggish bets with strange holdings such as Q8 so that on a flop of 248 or 4810 they are unlikely to fold any bet you make and only an A or a K later on will help you. The more experienced you get the more you when they have this and when they are chasing. If you are in early position you should probably bet the minimum that would cause others to fold. If you are called then you should be thinking to cap the betting if you dont get a favorable turn. You might try a second time to steal the pot but should fold to a reraise. Late position you can fold if you feel you are up against a hand or call if you have pot odds to do so. Remember though that on a flop of 479 you could be up against 9K or 9A so you have to be careful. Still if you have been watching betting patterns then you should have a reasonable idea where you stand.

I dont know how closely you have read this but the message should be clear. Preflop in early position you should check/small bet them and late position you should bet more. This is only a general rule and you can adapt it to see what works best against your opponents but this is my conclusion. In late position you are better placed to know where you stand if no A or K hits. You do lose the "who bets first wins" situation but you will probably make more profit from a big pot raise preflop than you will lose. If an A or a K flops then you are in perfect position to maximise profit. OK now if you are in early position and the pot is small then 3 things are accomplised 1) you have not invested many chips in the pot 2) it is less appealing to bluffers 3) people probably will not read you as AK so that you can win big against KQ, AQ etc. Chose between checking and betting on a flop that doesnt help you. The only think you have to be careful of is not making things too obvious. There is something to be said for betting whether or not the flop helps you or checking whether or not the flop helps you as that makes it harder to read.

OK early position what if the flop is 2 hearts and an A what do you do? If the pot is bet you have to bet probably but if it is small you can always check the flop and bet the turn. The only problem with this is it sets you up for a bluff on the river if a heart comes but avoids costing you chips if a heart comes up on the turn and you feel a flush is likely. Personally I like checking these hands or betting them and betting IF a heart comes and checking if it doesnt - but you have to judge whether it is worth some chips to deceive your opponents or not. Anyway that is quite a tricky situation.

In conclusion I advocate 1) AK suited or not is the hardest premium hand to play 2) all in pre flop is a valid way of playing the hand if you dont mind taking risks 3) generally you should bet more with AK in late position than in early 4) you should be wary of scare cards on flop or turn and not try to maximise profits when these cards appear settle for modest profits even when you think you have the hand won and your losses will never be too large and 5) realise that the hand is very difficult to play if it is a big pot and you get no help from the flop.
  
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:52 AM
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Very nice post Scottish. I can see that only someone like me would be able to write a piece better than that (Me who lost a $100 pot with AK)

Seriously though, i do agree. AK si a good hand but can get a playe rinto a lot of trouble if they overvaluse the cards. Poeple do the same with AA, remember a pair is one of the worst possible poker hands and that when playing AA the opponent has a etter drawing oppertunity than yourself.

When you say AK is not nearley as glamerous as AA i will have to dissagree there. AK is a very good drawing hand. You have 6 outs to hit top pair and there is then the change of your Nut straight and Nut flush. Not to mention that if you make a marginal bet pre flop that you will not be called by rags. So if the flo does come somehting like 236 off you will be able to bluff with our AK and more of th etime, so long as you are not up againse 22, 33, 66 or an overpair you will take the pot without much problem.

AK is a good hand but i iwll also agree that AK is overvalued. But saying that i believe AQ, AA, and KK are overvalued too. Other than that i do agree with what you have said. Very nice atricle scottish
  
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Old 06-28-2005, 05:02 AM
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I have to disagree that KK should be slow play. It should be played fast like AA. But if an A flops should be played carefully from that point.

And calling or checking QQ or JJ isn't necessarily slow playing them if there is a raise and only you and the raiser stay in calling is a sensible thing to do so you can see if the flop is favorable for you or not.

In a Fixed game, which it seems you are talking about. QQ and JJ can be raised if you feel you can lower the amount of people that will stay in the hand. Then again. See the flop and plan your next more from there. It is also slight deceptive because you can bet the flop hoping people will believe you have a bigger pair if an A or K showes up. Of course if you are reraised at this point you have to look play carefully at the point. Because like someone has pair the A or K and you only have a few outs to beat that hand. Assuming you risk staying in the hand with 2nd pair.
  
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Old 06-28-2005, 05:16 AM
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AK suited is only the 14th best starting hand in my opinion its way overated especially if off suited but most people bet it as if it was second best . but watching poker on tv they over value the hand too
  
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Old 06-28-2005, 07:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdice
AK suited is only the 14th best starting hand in my opinion its way overated especially if off suited but most people bet it as if it was second best . but watching poker on tv they over value the hand too
AKs is the fourth best hand (in a nine handed ring game, with the hands played through to the river)
  
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Old 06-28-2005, 05:21 PM
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Here is a list of the top 42 starting hands in NLHE, the number next to the hand represents its Earning Value (in other words, that is your advantage)

Cards EV
AA 2.32
KK 1.67
QQ 1.22
JJ 0.86
AK s 0.78
AQ s 0.59
TT 0.58
AK 0.51
AJ s 0.44
KQ s 0.39
99 0.38
AT s 0.32
AQ 0.31
KJ s 0.29
88 0.25
QJ s 0.23
KT s 0.20
A9 s 0.19
AJ 0.19
QT s 0.17
KQ 0.16
77 0.16
JT s 0.15
A8 s 0.10
K9 s 0.09
AT 0.08
A5 s 0.08
A7s 0.08
KJ 0.08
66 0.07
T9 s 0.05
A4 s 0.05
Q9 s 0.05
J9 s 0.04
QJ 0.03
A6 s 0.03
55 0.02
A3 s 0.02
K8 s 0.01
KT 0.01
98 s 0.00
T8 s -0.00
K7 s -0.00
A2 s 0.00
  
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Old 06-29-2005, 11:11 AM
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AK is easy to play Ben...there is a pile on the table that they call a muck pile...that is where AK belongs...at least as far as I'm concerned. I will take any two cards other than AK after not hitting them for a year...I would just like to know how much they cost me!

As I explained in another post...I did hit it twice two days ago. The first time, I flopped AKK went all-in at the flop...had two callers and one of the callers also had AK...so after not hitting it for a year, I then have to split the pot after hitting it the first time. The hand right after that one I again had AK and went all-in pre-flop...was called by QJo...flopped a K and thought my luck was changing...QJ drew a str8.

The only hands that I won with AK is when I go all-in pre-flop and everyone folds....However I can do that with 72o also!

Last edited by CRAPSHOOT; 06-30-2005 at 08:02 AM.
  
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Old 07-07-2005, 03:04 AM
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Crapshoot; I find your reply a little overly exaggerated. Sure everyone has their personal favorites/hates toward particular hands. However as Scottish mentioned in his post, AK is one of hold'em's premium hands. However it is also hold'em's hardest hand to play. I'm not knocking your decision not to play it (I'm sure it is with good reason, and plenty of bad beats ) however if you can play the hand properly it is a valuable asset.

Great post Scottish, I have struggled with this hand the past two years I have been playing hold'em avidly. Your post outlined some great tips and guidelines to help minimize the losses due to this dangerous hand.

Thanks

indica
  
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Old 07-09-2005, 02:55 AM
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A-K... 4th best starting hand... hell no, thats all I got to say to the crappy ass post! its up there, but not forth, i'd rathe see pocket 10's than AK
  
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Old 07-10-2005, 11:49 PM
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AK is nicknamed big slick for a reason. It can be very powerful if you hit, especially against and opponent with AT-AQ. But also, people tend to overvalue it in that they cant let it go when it doesnt hit. BAsically, the hand cant take too much heat if it doesnt hit.
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